Home › Forums › MGTOW Central › An alpha without the experience of relationships
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Eric Lauder 3 years, 5 months ago.
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Besides, why should you buy into PUA concepts?
Exactly. Especially when they only work on the sort of women who fall for PUA tactics, and even then only barely. What sane man would want that?
I see guys chasing women and it always seems like way too much work to me, especially since once you stop giving any f~~~s and refuse to chasing women they start throwing themselves at you.
What he doesn’t understand, and this is a scientific fact observed in the animal kingdom (apes if I remember correctly) is that alphas have abnormally high stress levels.
But humans aren’t apes any more than they are dogs. And the correct term for gorillas is silverback, not alpha, because it’s a whole different social structure. Oh, and besides high stress levels another result of gorilla social structure is really REALLY tiny penises. Meanwhile humans have the largest c~~~s of all primates. Seriously. Look it up. We’re talking in a whole different league. Not because humans are somehow more “alpha” than gorillas, but because our reproductive behavior is completely different from any other primate.
Most combat veterans have self-control issues.
Where the hell did you get that? That doesn’t even make any sense. If they didn’t have any self control then they wouldn’t have become combat veterans. They’d have rapidly become combat casualties.
Anonymous54Heres one for you girls. I saw a show once about non speaking ww2 vets. Normandy. They rounded up all the dead bodys,put them back on the Hutchin boats. This guys job was to jump up and down on the piles of bodys,to pack them to fit more on.An older officer was killed. He was this guys F~~~ING HERO. He had to jump up and down on his body just like the others. The Man was sobbing telling this story. Whatch your f~~~ing mouth when speaking about combat veterans. They may not say anything,but I sure as s~~~ f~~~ing will.
You need to expand that number, not I.
I’ve been a combat vet since 1991 which might be longer than you’ve been alive.
All you know about combat vets is what the mainstream media tells you and we all here know how they lie.
You grew up surrounded by combat vets from WW2, Korea, and Vietnam and never even realized it. They were and are men in all walks of life and in all occupations. The only time you learn they are vets is when something happens and the media’s confirmation bias kicks in.
You might as well claim that “most” black males are felons.
First, to avoid confusion, in regards to “combat vet” I am assuming men who are/or where in literal combat…not support troops.
Now with that being said, and I want to reiterate (as I already have), that most vets who have seen actual combat have alot issues they need to deal with and most of the time (and I have to reiterate that point of “most”) they end up with serious issues.
Must great-uncle was in the battle of the bulge and came back with alot of issues. He was also, for lack of better terminology, a real asshole.
Vets who came out of Iraq, that I either went to school with or worked with, had implied personal issues of guilt and confusion in regards to coming back home.
In regards to hard numbers, for the sake of clarity, I would say that (only in accords with my limited personal experience) that about 60-70% come back with issues of self-control in either anger, drunkeness, sex-addiction, etc.
These are not “alpha” characterisitics, if one were to look at the concept of “alpha” in loose terms (as noone seems to agree as to what it is.
Now are these “bad” men? No. Are they men? Yes. Do they deserve the honors/benefits/etc. they have earned? Yes. Do they deserve more? Yes. But regardless of what they deserve, which is alot…the characteristics they possess, as in lack of self-control (however justifiable it may be) do not count as “alpha” behavior.
All I am really arguing, and this may clarify my point further, is that regardless of how “alpha” one man or group of men may be, the corresponding negative traits take away from it.
To further clarify my point: There are no “alpha’s” (or betas, gammas, etc.) just men who have suffered more than others.
Maybe, on a personal note, all the people who “went to combat” that I was exposed to were just assholes prior to it and the war magnified it. That is a legitimate possibility. But regardless of what I am stating, the whole “fight and f~~~” mentality doesn’t constitute an “alpha” in a more positive sense of the term (self-control, just, etc.)
But then again, this argument can be reduced to a question of semantics as to what “alpha” really is…
So take it for what it is worth.
But humans aren’t apes any more than they are dogs. And the correct term for gorillas is silverback, not alpha, because it’s a whole different social structure. Oh, and besides high stress levels another result of gorilla social structure is really REALLY tiny penises. Meanwhile humans have the largest c~~~s of all primates. Seriously. Look it up. We’re talking in a whole different league. Not because humans are somehow more “alpha” than gorillas, but because our reproductive behavior is completely different from any other primate.
The increase in dominate behavior, regardless of species (human or non-human) correlates with an increase in cortisol and stress hormones. If one were to apply this to human beings, with special forces being the premise as to the alpha’s of the military world, the results still correlate with animal studies. To not get off to far topic, this kid doesn’t look like he seen too much of any form of stress…real or imaginary.
Where the hell did you get that? That doesn’t even make any sense. If they didn’t have any self control then they wouldn’t have become combat veterans. They’d have rapidly become combat casualties.
Drunkenness, barfights, and/or sexual addiction… for the vast majority. I am not claiming, nor have claimed, all vets are like this… but to ignore the obvious is foolish. But don’t take this as a “f~~~ all vets” thing because this is far from that.
Drunkenness, barfights, and/or sexual addiction… for the vast majority.
Citation needed bro.
Citation needed bro.
Well if I “cited” it than I wouldn’t know what I would be talking about, because life is a whole lot more than “reading”. So I would be short changing myself.
However If I did “cite it” you would claim I don’t know what I am talking about.
That question is faulty.
Like I said before, because unless I am mistaken, I am sensing increased “tension”…..but maybe I am wrong. Regardless placing veterans, or anyone else for that matter (not them only), on a pedestal is unhealthy. They are people, like everyone else……not above or below anyone.
First, to avoid confusion, in regards to “combat vet” I am assuming men who are/or where in literal combat…not support troops.
So now you’re insulting REMFs?
I remember some of those worthless support troops in my first war. They were a Pennsylvania Guard unit stationed in a warehouse in Dhahran ensuring all us more important real combat soldiers had clean water to drink. Then the SCUD hit and killed 28 of them.
That’s 28 bodies out of the total 150 KIA for the entire war but they didn’t count because they’re just f~~~ing REMFs and not real soldiers, right?
Now with that being said, and I want to reiterate (as I already have), that most vets who have seen actual combat have alot issues they need to deal with and most of the time (and I have to reiterate that point of “most”) they end up with serious issues.
You know nothing. Your anecdotes are nothing, your experiences are nothing, your observations are nothing, your beliefs are nothing.
In regards to hard numbers, for the sake of clarity, I would say that (only in accords with my limited personal experience) that about 60-70% come back with issues of self-control in either anger, drunkeness, sex-addiction, etc.
Just you limited personal experience again, huh? I’d ask you for a cite of any study but, since you’re just making s~~~ up, I won’t bother. When you find yourself in a hole, it’s best to put down the shovel John.
And, seeing as Keymaster recently had to remind us about acting civilly towards each other, I’m done talking with you.
Do not date. Do not impregnate. Do not co-habitate. Above all, do not marry. Reclaim and never again surrender your personal sovereignty.
So now you’re insulting REMFs?
Yeah, I guess your the “old guy who is offended” every time I come to these forums. I swear, there is a slot in the “mgtow universe” for guys like you every time I communicate a thought. Don’t take it personally, because after your done/gone/whatever, someone will be there to replace you. You will probably even say “wtf is this “kid” talking about?” And my response is that either you were not on these forums long enough, or we have not been acquainted enough. So with that being said:
I will simplify this even more: Men who kill other men in war are not happy about it. Whether you want to talk from personal experience, knowing people (relationships), studies, or just plain common sense and everyday life observations this fact remains evident. These men are consumed with sorrow and lose self-control over it. “Is it justified?” Who knows, maybe only God does. But regardless alcoholism, sexual addiction (strip-clubs, pornography, hookers) and general basic violence (bar-fights, lashing out in anger) is not conducive to “alpha-conduct”. And that for all the “positives” such as “bravery/self-sacrifice/etc.) that these men exhibit, most (and I cannot reiterate this point enough) also exhibit negative behaviors that relegate them no better than everyone else in a different respect.
So…this should clarify things. Am I insulting anyone (or have)? No. Am I being disrespectful? Well, according to you I am, but I think this has less to do with any “ideology” or “common sense” but rather that you need some validation from some younger guy…which is quite pathetic because according to you I “know nothing” so why should you care about what I saying when I am not insulting anyone? To be quite frank, you are just another one of those guys who think “I suffered alot the world owes me something”…and what you forget or probably never learned is that noone cares. And to be quite frank, while we are being “personal” I don’t think that you are as “angry” with me as you are “envious” of those men as you believe they are “better” than you.
This “insult” that you claim is less about me and more about what you think of yourself. And to be frank, it is so common in this world…this insecurity about one self, that I cannot help to address because I am killing two birds with one stone when I say this. No one is better or less than you “OldBill”. No one is better or less than me. Period. Get over yourself…or chill…whatever…I am just a number like everyone else remember that.
Anonymous3Tuna alert. Denigrating other men and playing the victim about it afterwards. Even the name “John Doe” screams of a c~~~.
No one is better or less than you “OldBill”. No one is better or less than me. Period.
Then
Denigrating other men and playing the victim about it afterwards.
Even the name “John Doe” screams of a c~~~.
I have a better idea I will just make a thread for “those p~~~ed off by John Doe” so Paul can have his own thread. Wait a moment….
/forums/topic/for-those-who-hateangered-by-john-doe/
There it is.It’s just dating advice for introverted technogeeks.
Here’s some dating advice for introverted techno geeks and it’s free.
Spend your twenties and early thirties make a metric s~~~ ton of money in the IT industry. Use escorts for any physical needs.
Beginning in your mid-thirties, start fending off the horde of near-Wall ex-c~~~ carousel riders angling for your wallet through your c~~~. Pick and choose, pump and dump, and never ever commit.
Once you hit forty, parlay your money and their daddy issues into f~~~ing bright eyed 20 somethings. Again, pick and choose, pump and dump, and never ever commit.
That’s all you need to know and you got it for free.
This is the end-all-say-all. Damn right, Bill
Anonymous3No one is better or less than you “OldBill”. No one is better or less than me. Period.
Then:
Denigrating other men and playing the victim about it afterwards.
Even the name “John Doe” screams of a c~~~.
I have a better idea I will just make a thread for “those p~~~ed off by John Doe” so Paul can have his own thread. What a moment….
Typical female tactics. Talk s~~~, then back peddle and pull things out of context to try to win an “argument”.
I have news for you, we can see through that garbage here and are not impressed. Pull your bulls~~~ somewhere else.
The second you started insulting veterans and making gradients according to YOUR definition, you lost the right to play victim. F~~~ you and your gynocratic bulls~~~.
Anonymous0But regardless alcoholism, sexual addiction (strip-clubs, pornography, hookers) and general basic violence (bar-fights, lashing out in anger) is not conducive to “alpha-conduct”.
This thread keeps getting more and more silly. I’ve read lots of reports on mental health issues among returning vets. They do talk about some alcohol-related issues. Not anywhere near the levels that *you* claim, but they exist. However, sex addiction? You’re just pulling that out of your butt. That doesn’t even show up in the literature. Hell, a lot of the psychiatric field doesn’t even consider sex addiction to be a true disorder.
Anyway, I’m not in disagreement with you on the main point: Going off to war doesn’t automatically turn a man into an “alpha.” When Old Sage claimed that veterans were automatically “alphas,” he was just engaging in a little hyperbole. That is, Old Sage was just repudiating the OP’s claim that the OP had somehow been turned into an “alpha” by reading a dating site. And in the process Old Sage was exaggerating in deference to vets. But apparently you took Old Sage’s statement a little too literally and had to make a big deal of it. You had to argue the point into the ground and even claim that the majority of returning vets are afflicted with “sex addiction” as evidence that they’re not “alphas.” Frankly it all points to problems on your end.
In the end, it comes down to one thing: Lighten up, dude.
Anyway, this has been a dumb thread, and it just keeps getting dumber. Like OldBill, I’m through with this thread.
http://salem-news.com/articles/june082010/wwii-ptsd-pl.php
http://www.selfgrowth.com/articles/prevalence-of-addiction-and-alcoholism-in-vietnam-war-veterans
http://veteransandptsd.com/PTSD-statistics.html
This one comes from a seperate perspective where the culture may actually cause it.
Stress at Home, Not Combat, at Root of Alcoholism Among National Guard Vets
There are a few here, some “contradictory” but for the most part correlative.
Do you want me to go into statistics about Sexual addiction or violence too? Or how my uncles who came from fighting WWII were assholes? Or the guys I went to school with having drinking and sex addiction problems? L
Anonymous54Kid go away.You want to meet an alph male?get in your car ,find a 30 mph zone. Go about 60mph. There will be blue lights. Pull over,role down you window. Say hi to an alpha male. See easy!! Now f~~~ of little Puke. Your intelegent yes..but an asshole yes. Insulting old folks and war veterans. Would you like to kick my dog while your at it? Just go away man.Combat veterans drink,have aggression problems? Use your little brain and try and figure out why. Now PLEASE PLEASE go away.
@paul23 Welcome and it’s good to know you’re focussed on personal success as a priority over women, dating, and relationships.
I know better than to ever debate the “alpha/beta” thing at all, but I wanted to let you know that you’re among men who vehemently reject those definitions… except perhaps to describe certain BEHAVIORS.
You likened “alpha” to a lion, but there is the “alpha” lion (behavior) and “beta” lion (behavior). The “alpha” is the one who is perceived as the most
• UNPREDICTABLE
• UNCONTROLLABLE
• CHALLENGING
• DOMINANTThose are the 4 core “alpha” behaviors and qualities. Males who display none (or little) of those qualities are what some would call “beta”.
For animals, it all comes down to breeding power. And in the animal kingdom, that is the “pinnacle of success”. That’s the BEST an “alpha male” (lion) is ever gonna do. Survive and breed,
… except it doesn’t apply to humans. (as @sidecar said) because survival and breeding are NOT the “pinnacle of success” for MEN. Breeding is not “the best you can do”. Even you know this. A woman will just as easily f~~~ a greasy, tattoo-ridden, unemployed musician on a stolen motorbike who has enough body piercings to hang a shower curtain.
He’s no more “alpha” than I am.
A MAN (human) can achieve far greater success and legacies than merely survival and breeding. So be careful being seduced or subscribing to the female/PUA definitions of “alpha” and “beta” – based solely on breeding options. It’s a bunch of bulls~~~.
PUAs will attempt to sell it to you.
( “that beta / can’t get laid” etc. )WOMEN will attempt to sell it to you.
(i.e you’re a “loser” if you don’t have a girlfriend etc.)If you keep doing what you've always done... you're gonna keep getting what you always got.Kid go away.You want to meet an alph male?get in your car ,find a 30 mph zone. Go about 60mph. There will be blue lights. Pull over,role down you window. Say hi to an alpha male. See easy!! Now f~~~ of little Puke. Your intelegent yes..but an asshole yes. Insulting old folks and war veterans. Would you like to kick my dog while your at it? Just go away man.Combat veterans drink,have aggression problems? Use your little brain and try and figure out why. Now PLEASE PLEASE go away.
/forums/topic/for-those-who-hateangered-by-john-doe/#post-280692
There is a thread for this, we don’t want to disturb Paul. He might be sleeping. And don’t hate me hate post #280675
And a fun fact, my internship in college was with the sheriff’s department and county jail. A little fun fact…but you can attack it here:
/forums/topic/for-those-who-hateangered-by-john-doe/#post-280692
Anonymous54Kid go away.You want to meet an alph male?get in your car ,find a 30 mph zone. Go about 60mph. There will be blue lights. Pull over,role down you window. Say hi to an alpha male. See easy!! Now f~~~ of little Puke. Your intelegent yes..but an asshole yes. Insulting old folks and war veterans. Would you like to kick my dog while your at it? Just go away man.Combat veterans drink,have aggression problems? Use your little brain and try and figure out why. Now PLEASE PLEASE go away.
/forums/topic/for-those-who-hateangered-by-john-doe/#post-280692
There is a thread for this, we don’t want to disturb Paul. He might be sleeping. And don’t hate me hate post #280675
And a fun fact, my internship in college was with the sheriff’s department and county jail. A little fun fact…but you can attack it here:
/forums/topic/for-those-who-hateangered-by-john-doe/#post-280692
you no longer interest me. Yawn….
For the record:
– Veteran status doesn’t automatically confer alpha status
– Combat veteran status doesn’t either
– Alpha status is primarily bulls~~~ concocted by PUA pussy beggars and other con artists interested in selling stuff to credulous foolsActions, not words or labels, define the man. Act like the man you want to be.
Do not date. Do not impregnate. Do not co-habitate. Above all, do not marry. Reclaim and never again surrender your personal sovereignty.
– Veteran status doesn’t automatically confer alpha status
– Combat veteran status doesn’t either
– Alpha status is primarily bulls~~~ concocted by PUA pussy beggars and other con artists interested in selling stuff to credulous fools+1 Good, at least we can start agreeing on something.
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