Initiation rites, boys to men.

[Ranger OneParticipant 16836]

X11 wrote:

Tbh I see ancient initiations to be in conflict with a feminist agenda, its men that performed the ritual and women that submitted to the boy now made a man. Antithesis of today where men stay as imbecile castrated puppies.

Where you are getting caught up in, is that it is not simply feminism vs patriarchy. Feminism and patriarchy are BOTH gynocentric. MGTOW doesn’t subscribe to either.

Patriarchy simply delineates male roles, including leadership, but men are still used as cannon fodder and women are coddled. How about the whole “women and children” off the ship first of European patriarchal society?

Screw that. Neither Tradcon patriarchal nor feminist society is on my side. I consider myself to be more than a disposable commodity, and screw any society that doesn’t.

All my life I've had doubts about who I am, where I belonged. Now I'm like the arrow that springs from the bow. No hesitation, no doubts. The path is clear. And what are you? Alive. Everything else is negotiable. Women have rights; men have responsibilities; MGTOW have freedom. Marriage is for chumps. If someone stands in the way of true justice, you simply walk up behind them and stab them in the heart-R'as al Ghul.

[Puffin StuffParticipant 24979]

Modern rite of passage for a modern boy spends a month going his own way to prove he’s a man.

Send him off to the wilds with limited resources. A cabin he can stay in. Basic comforts like couch and bed.

No TV, video games, phones or any other communication with the outside world.

Only enough food so that if he doesn’t hunt with the tools provided he will not make it the month.

You get the idea.

Like surviving pain it would teach a boy an important life lesson, depending on yourself and knowing you are complete without outside help, maturity, is the only thing necessary to become a man.

A rite of passage that involves men going their own way would teach a boy how not to become a slave to a woman and society, he doesn’t need them to be happy.

#icethemout; Remember Thomas Ball. He died for your children.

[X11Spectator 4520]

Good point, makes me think.

As someone who went thru, homosexuality (didn’t get sexual), asexuality, antinatalism, efilism and I never married I realised the logical conclusion of my thinking was human life would end if everyone followed those paths.

I personally am not propagating my genes.

Now you guys, are you proposing all sex and all family making stops, is that mgtow? are you saying just fuk women and if they get pregnant then too bad or don’t fuk them at all and be asexual.

Help me out here, what is the logical conclusion to mgtow.

I have to think something thru like a math equation with a logical set of steps to a conclusion.

[Puffin StuffParticipant 24979]

Logical argument for men going their own way:

“No f~~~s given.”

In my opinion.

#icethemout; Remember Thomas Ball. He died for your children.

[Ranger OneParticipant 16836]

X11 wrote:

Now you guys, are you proposing all sex and all family making stops, is that mgtow? are you saying just fuk women and if they get pregnant then too bad or don’t fuk them at all and be asexual.

Help me out here, what is the logical conclusion to mgtow.

I have to think something thru like a math equation with a logical set of steps to a conclusion.

Obviously all family making won’t stop, because I believe in self-determination not control, and some men will always choose to propagate.

There is no logical conclusion to MGTOW. The logical conclusion to me INDIVIDUALLY is that I lead a more fulfilling life, not drained of resources and not placing my sense of value or worth in the hands of someone that cannot ever be pleased (women).

Are you a Linux geek, out of curiosity?

All my life I've had doubts about who I am, where I belonged. Now I'm like the arrow that springs from the bow. No hesitation, no doubts. The path is clear. And what are you? Alive. Everything else is negotiable. Women have rights; men have responsibilities; MGTOW have freedom. Marriage is for chumps. If someone stands in the way of true justice, you simply walk up behind them and stab them in the heart-R'as al Ghul.

[X11Spectator 4520]

No fuks given about society, family, community, future..??

[Anonymous 0]

X11 wrote:

Now you guys

This is when the benefit of my doubt was withdrawn.

X11 wrote:

Help me out here, what is the logical conclusion to mgtow.

I choose not to be a part of your survey.

[Puffin StuffParticipant 24979]

Even to your question.

I’m answering your questions because you are new and I want to be friendly.

But, in my opinion you could easily extend the moniker to “men going their own way” and “not giving a s~~~”.

So, we don’t define ourselves. We don’t give a s~~~ what others think.

We each go our own way.

#icethemout; Remember Thomas Ball. He died for your children.

[X11Spectator 4520]

Ranger One wrote:

X11 wrote:
Now you guys, are you proposing all sex and all family making stops, is that mgtow? are you saying just fuk women and if they get pregnant then too bad or don’t fuk them at all and be asexual.

Help me out here, what is the logical conclusion to mgtow.

I have to think something thru like a math equation with a logical set of steps to a conclusion.

Obviously all family making won’t stop, because I believe in self-determination not control, and some men will always choose to propagate.

There is no logical conclusion to MGTOW. The logical conclusion to me INDIVIDUALLY is that I lead a more fulfilling life, not drained of resources and not placing my sense of value or worth in the hands of someone that cannot ever be pleased (women).

Are you a Linux geek, out of curiosity?

Ah, so mgtow is not a rigorous philosophy, its more like a thought.

Re Linux, a lived in a share house of hackers once, one guy has his name on every computer that ever is on the internet, he is on the credit list for some unix code he wrote for free that the internet is built on, I don’t know s~~~ but that’s where x11 comes from in part.

[KeymasterKeymaster]

X11 wrote:

Our society is the only one to have abandoned these and we banned them from ancient cultures.

In some ancient/old/tribal cultures , an 11/12 year old boy would be ripped from his mothers arms and covered in a solution and thrown in a cold, dark, rock cave and left there to be “tasted” by bugs an other creatures. He was left there – alone in the cold wet dark – for a day or two to be AS TERRIFIED AS POSSIBLE. They wouldn’t even tell him why they did it.

When he emerged, he was … suddenly different.

And that was the moment he learned ->> “his mothers arms” do NOTHING to protect him from the cold hard reality of the world. So he would immediately stop looking for (and relying on) that comfort in a woman’s bosom because it’s essentially worthless to him, and he realized it was now going to be up to HIM.

Now transformed, he would never look at his mother (or women) the same way again. He didn’t need her for anything. What could she possibly provide that was of any real value?

X11 wrote:

Could this be linked to the mangina epidemic. Are we robbing young men of something they need?

That could follow.

But does a modern mother teach a man what he REALLY needs to know???
Does she care about HIS best interests?
Or does “society” push men to place women first above themselves.

The mangina epidemic is a systematic castration of the male by the female who PREFERS it…. and then turns around and immediately resents him for being “weak”.

They cultivate their own “manginas”.
And they deserve each other.

If you keep doing what you've always done... you're gonna keep getting what you always got.

[X11Spectator 4520]

Jeez if it wasn’t illegal I would post a pic of my dick next to my driver licence to settle the snowflakes that think I am some feminist infiltrator doing a covert mysterious survey FFS.

What next I am Jewish, globalist illuminati.

[KeymasterKeymaster]

X11 wrote:

Jeez if it wasn’t illegal I would post a pic of my dick next to my driver licence to settle the snowflakes that think I am some feminist infiltrator

Well you can’t be too surprised. This is a men-only forum and we’ve seen plenty of that already.

You opened with a “we” like “we” are somehow responsible for weakening men, but you also used the word “society”.

Society is —>> WOMEN.

That’s the bulk of the shreaking noise you hear anywhere you go. Restaurants. Even Online. Women are the loud chatter of society and always have been. They were even called “socialites”. Close your mouth an open your ears, and you’ll always hear women. Close your ears and open your eyes and you see the work of MEN that goes on quietly (and largely unnoticed!) all around you.

“Are we robbing young men of something they need?”

No. “WE” are not robbing men of anything.

But women certainly are.

Let a woman have her way and “mold you”, she will always want you to be “more like a woman” and force “female values” and feminine ways of thinking on you. She would reach right for your “ego” (self-esteem) and stomp on it if she could have her way. And then she will resent you and accuse you of being “weak” when she succeeds. Classic and predictable.

“Where are all the real men?”
It’s her own fault.

---

PRIME EXAMPLE: Canadian toxic mom dresses her son in (matching!) girly outfits. So now you know where all the cucked manginas come from. And one day, he’s gonna hear a woman ask “where are all the real men?”. Shim is gonna have no f~~~ing idea what she’s talking about, and “he” will want to borrow her dress instead.

https://saboteur365.wordpress.com/2017/06/02/wtf-canadian-mom-photographs-five-year-old-son-in-dresses-to-delight-of-imbecile-liberals-everywhere/

If you keep doing what you've always done... you're gonna keep getting what you always got.

[Shadow1275Participant 1178]

Don’t need initiation rites to be man. Frankly put why don’t Women ever need initiation rites to be Women? If we follow your “logic” to the ultimate conclusion

How did Men become Men before there were Initiation Rites?

In order to have Women you need Adversity and Humans who are too cowardly to face nature and get their own resources but have no problem leaching after others.

In order to have Men you need to have Adversity and Humans who are BRAVE ENOUGH to face Nature head on to gain there own resources, thereby evolving to be stronger and smarter.

There are plenty of Conquerors in history who took no Rites of passage to be great-Eisenhower, Washington, Agrippa, etc.

And there are plenty of Inventors who took no rites of passage to be great- Edison, Newton, Leonardo Da Vinci etc.

But each faced plenty of Adversity, more than ANY WOMAN could even hope to deal with in their lifetime

He who is Brave is Free - Seneca

[Big BossParticipant 4496]

xlrsnbrg wrote:

Many rites of passage involved circumcision. Some also severing the urethra at the base of the penis so that men pee like women. Some required eating your own foreskin after circumcision.

Yeah… uh.. that’s actually a religious rite. Like Saturn/Chronos worship. That has nothing to do really with manhood. It is more of a sacrificial practice to gods.

[Ranger OneParticipant 16836]

X11 wrote:

No fuks given about society, family, community, future..??

No fuks given. You will see NFG quite a lot here. In fact, if I have a central unifying mantra in my own personal life, it is NFG.

I am concerned about myself and my kids, everything else not so much. The future will attend to itself. In the end, billions of years from now, the universe will succumb to heat death (entropy) so nothing is of permanence.

Community, society? Which community and society? The one that invented “no-fault divorce” or the one that supports false-rape accusations.

Society is just a tool for female parasites to optimize resource extractions from males via taxation, including males that won’t allow themselves to be exploited directly using marriage and divorce.

All my life I've had doubts about who I am, where I belonged. Now I'm like the arrow that springs from the bow. No hesitation, no doubts. The path is clear. And what are you? Alive. Everything else is negotiable. Women have rights; men have responsibilities; MGTOW have freedom. Marriage is for chumps. If someone stands in the way of true justice, you simply walk up behind them and stab them in the heart-R'as al Ghul.

[narwhalParticipant]

Initiation rites at their core are just a group of men showing accept and respect to individual men, and I believe it does matter. I do believe that men need to know they have what it takes and that other men recognize it in them.

I think a huge benefit to this site is that it does provide some of that to men. The collective men here are constantly showing our acceptance and respect to each other as men. Something that is often difficult to get outside. We have a star system that shows experience among members. We have a punt count that people take great pride in. Those things only have meaning because they are granted from one man to another.

Yes, there are initiation rites, achievement recognition awards, and such out there, but most of them have been tainted by allowing women to be participants and judges. It’s watered down so that achievement is a junk participation award. It means little because it wasn’t really earned.

Boys absolutely crave this. They play football because they want the acceptance of their peers and of other men. They join neighborhood gangs to get that acceptance.

We had some neighbors over a couple weeks ago to swim in the pool. They have two boys around my boys age and they were both doing flips into the pool. My son can’t do it, but has been practicing ever since then. He wants me to watch every single flip to tell him what to do and when he’s achieved this goal. It suddenly meant something to him because he sees it as a way to get approval from peers and from older men that he respects.

I do think men would be better off if we provided more acceptance and encouragement in other men and boys, while ignore women’s efforts to disrupt that.

Ok. Then do it.

[GrumpyParticipant]

TLDR:
A girl is a woman at the onset of puberty, a boy is a man when some woman decides he is.

The initiation/rite of passage for a girl to become a woman is and has been historically acknowledged by the commencement of her first menstruation cycle. That is it, that alone makes her a “woman” in the eyes of humanity because it physically represents her ability to reproduce.

The initiation/rites of passage for most men, in this supposedly civilized world begins at birth and does not end until the day you die. It is a lifetime of adversity, constant sacrifice, and abuse.
Even then you are still judged as just “one of the boys” at best, or some nameless faceless peon that was just there at worst.
With the exception of a select few men in history you will be judged as just some guy unless the word MAN can be used to advance the constant bulls~~~ narrative of the perpetual victim hood of women.

Like billions of men before me, I have learned how to hunt/fish/butcher/build/maintain/destroy/rebuild/cook/clean/provided resources and protection for myself and others, served my nation, participated in numerous failed “relationships”, raised my offspring, and sacrificed for the benefit of others.
Yet, I am still a boy based solely on the whim or discretion of some weak assed mangina or pretentious woman.

There was a time in my life when I gave a fuck. Now you have to pay ME for it

[TaxGuyParticipant]

X11 wrote:

No fuks given about society, family, community, future..??

Personally, I don’t think that I’m so important to the future of mankind that it will be destroyed if I don’t get remarried. That’s putting myself up on quite a pedestal don’t you think? Frankly men that did go their own way made way more contributions to society than any of us that dropped a load in a vagina and created a child. That’s the funny thing about a society, any one individual rarely makes much of an impact on the society as a whole.

Isn’t society just a bunch of individuals doing their own thing with a collective agreed upon set of rules and laws? And the rules and laws change over time.

My prediction: Whenever our society collapses and the dust has settled, the historians won’t go back and pin it on me not getting remarried at age 52 or something I posted on this website. I think society will sink or swim on its own regardless of what I do.

Order the good wine

[AkanbiParticipant 2120]

X11 wrote:

Akanbi wrote:

X11 wrote:

Are we robbing young men of something they need?

Please, who exactly are you calling ‘we’?

We, the tribal male elders.

Start making s~~~ right again etc.

If I understand this your response well, are you saying that you came on this board–of men who have decided to proclaim INDIVIDUAL Sovereingty–to say that ‘we’ should shoulder the onus of helping society to affirm its definition of what a man is/should be?

My brother make you no follow sheeple o. Look them and Go Your Way.

[GargamelSpectator 29101]

Akanbi wrote:

Gargamel wrote:

[as MGTOW] We now become a man by walking away from the creatures that always had set the standard of “when you are a man” and “when you are not”.

Can this be added to the front page quotes, please?

Well KM can have the copyright of everything I ever posted.

Walking away and (some time later) “returning” to the view of the mainstream hive as a sucessful business owner or “yuppie with money” gets you more respect, envy and jealousy than any “initiation ceremony” would ever do.

They say: You get pity for free. Envy and jealousy has to be earned.

Play the loser, they leave you alone, forget you and when you finished school and/or built a business, then they come crawling to you.

And then you can play with gold diggers and make fun of them.

Let me also define success: I am talking about NOT having all of these “standard problems” most “c~~~ed” men have. Being successful means having no debt, no worries, enough to get by, nothing in the back of your mind that makes your hair turn gray.

Nowadays, “becoming a man” excludes c~~~s.

A man won’t let anyone put him down over nothing or for any tiny reason. A real man will stand up for his opinion and do what is right.
That all by itself excludes c~~~s and the way they treat us. Or “TRY” to treat men that will no longer allow that.

I pay dues to the expectations of women with total indifference.

Management school and motivational training sets a certain standard in a man’s mind who is “in charge of his life”.

That standard in non-negotiable. You can’t be the boss of a company, be responsible for everything, have everyone looking up to you and the at the same be an obedient paper tiger at home. “Submitting” to your bossy c~~~ that hardly accomplished anything in life. At least not if you are a real man.

Woman and their constant negativity, nagging, bitching and criticizing absolutely don’t fit that positive mindset of an achiever.

Where are all of the good men?

They sit there, live alone, traumatized and turned off by female entitlement, phone addiction, cheating and insulting behavior…

…and ask themselves:

“Who took away all of the good women?”

In July of 2018, this honey pot forum was sold out to an unidentified NPC sock puppet and troll organization. Most independent thinkers and writers migrated to other MGTOW forums as a result of the never-ending infighting and deliberate trouble starting caused by members who were given "carte blanche" by the admin to do whatever they want. Before my departure, I only left a few thousand cat pics here to comfort and ridicule the feminist owners who now run this place. Their background agenda is to make MGTOW look like a club of losers the public eye. And during the course of 2019, they actually managed to destroy almost all other MGTOW venues as well. Here is the truth about "theindependentman.org" aka "TIM" which was created as an extended workbench to further divide the community. When you register, they install a spyware Zombie cookie on your browser that does all kinds of things the user does not know of: http://www.filedropper.com/essay-on-the-removal-of-malware-cookies-used-by-tim

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