This topic contains 52 replies, has 14 voices, and was last updated by 
Mysterious Man 2 years, 11 months ago.
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I’m not sure if I could hold down a 9-5 job or obey an order that does against my order. I was wondering if any brothers here were enlisted in any of the 5 branches of the military, so I acquire some anecdotal evidence to supplement my claims or refute them. Thanks in advance.
Well, consider that those military ‘slaves’ of past generations fought, sacrificed and died so that you can freely express your thoughts and feelings on an open and public forum like this one without fear of retribution.
In any case, I would not recommend a military career if your heart is not in it. You’ll only become a burden to your supervisors and your fellow servicemen.
OTOH, unless you were born with a silver spoon shoved up your ass, you might want to get used to the idea that whatever you do in life, you will very much likely end up compromising your personal ideals/principles to earn or keep a pay check.
That’s just the way it is for most people anyway…
Of course. I do acknowledge that the military in the past was entirely responsible for protecting my freedoms.
However, there is a f~~~ing difference between protecting our freedoms and “spreading” them to other countries. Our rights are being infringed upon in the name of ‘safety.’
Also, even though I was born with a silver spoon shoved up my ass, I don’t believe in signing away my freedom to a corporation. For most people, that is normal. For me, it is not.
"Our virtues and our failings are inseparable, like force and matter. When they separate, man is no more." -Nikola Tesla
I did a 4 year enlistment and would not trade the experience for the world. Traveling the world, friendships deeper than dudes you meet in the civilian world, not to mention the many technical trades you can get training and experience in.
If you can get past the philosophical stuff it can be worth it. You mentioned your parents wanting you to go in – is there a reason YOU want to go in?
If you don’t mind sharing, which branch did you enlist in?
The only reason for me to go to the military would be to advance my career as an entrepreneur and potentially acquire some skills that would benefit me in civilian life. However, I could just enroll in a tech school and acquire the same education without the bureaucracy. I feel that it’s just a way for my parents to exercise more control over me.
I was in the US Navy. Navy = N (never) A (again) V (volunteer) Y (yourself)! Yes, there is alot of bureaucratic bulls~~~ to be endured but looking back it was well worth it.
One difference compared to civilian tech schooling is that in the military you will gain experience in the trade you were schooled in. You learn other cool stuff too such as firefighting – on a ship everybody is a firefighter. And a ship – being mobile – provides a great way to travel.
And I will not leave my country; just as YOU have the right to spout your neocon Warhawk drivel I have the right to voice my LEGITIMATE concerns over the state of the Union. Totalitarianism and imperialism fell after WW2 since the world did not need it anymore. We don’t OWE anyone ANYTHING. The military does not deserve respect for conquering other nations and siphoning oil and gold at the expense of American citizens.
Actually I’m not a NEOCON warhawk, I opposed both Iraqi wars, and I did check my calendar yes its not the 19th century—-more’s the pity. And thank you for making my point—Capitalism IS why we have the standard of living we have—and that means trade—and that means importing raw materials and exporting finished goods—I assume you are familiar with mercantilism—and WHY the US fleet arrived in Japan in the mid 19th century—oh yes to open markets for trade. You see overseas trade requires a large merchant fleet which in turn requires ports and a large Navy to guard both. Not too sound like Marx but he would have argued that Capitalism is the fuel of imperialism. May I suggest you take a look at Alfred Mahan’s book the Influence of Sea Power upon History. THAT was the guiding though behind US policy in the 19th century.
I don’t buy Marx’s argument but you see imperialism and capitalism do have a symbiotic relationship. My point was merely that I thought you were in error asserting our “isolationist” history. Back to my original point. Accepting your misgivings about service to an empire–and your dislike of the Military industrial complex (which I share by the way—I’m not sure why you assumed I support it) the military may not be the best choice; I don’t know that you would be happy; especially if we end up in war with Iran, which is about a 50/50 likelihood.
By the way; what exactly is wrong with an empire…besides the fact they do fall eventually? But then every country falls eventually so I don’t know why that would be the criteria. But I’m interested in your reasoning.
I did a 4 year enlistment and would not trade the experience for the world. Traveling the world, friendships deeper than dudes you meet in the civilian world, not to mention the many technical trades you can get training and experience in.
If you can get past the philosophical stuff it can be worth it. You mentioned your parents wanting you to go in – is there a reason YOU want to go in?
If you don’t mind sharing, which branch did you enlist in?
The only reason for me to go to the military would be to advance my career as an entrepreneur and potentially acquire some skills that would benefit me in civilian life. However, I could just enroll in a tech school and acquire the same education without the bureaucracy. I feel that it’s just a way for my parents to exercise more control over me.
I was in the US Navy. Navy = N (never) A (again) V (volunteer) Y (yourself)! Yes, there is alot of bureaucratic bulls~~~ to be endured but looking back it was well worth it.
One difference compared to civilian tech schooling is that in the military you will gain experience in the trade you were schooled in. You learn other cool stuff too such as firefighting – on a ship everybody is a firefighter. And a ship – being mobile – provides a great way to travel.
Cool. My grandfather and many of my distant family members served in the Navy. Still, I may serve in the Coast Guard, Air Force or National Guard depending on where my heart is.
"Our virtues and our failings are inseparable, like force and matter. When they separate, man is no more." -Nikola Tesla
Also, even though I was born with a silver spoon shoved up my ass, I don’t believe in signing away my freedom to a corporation. For most people, that is normal. For me, it is not.
In that case you should forget the military. I’m thinkin’ maybe ‘Greenpeace’ instead…
By the way–I say a lot of things on these threads but one thing I don’t do is spout drivel so try and keep this adult and civil—after all you were the one asking for advice. If you don’t like or want my advice don’t take it.
And I repeat I don’t think you’re cut out for the military. Labeling/insults are the tactics of the irrational left. I suggest you will be ill served by that mechanism in the future.
I served many years in the Air Force. This thread reminds me of one female that I worked with who once said that she “didn’t think she could ever fire a gun at anybody even if it meant saving or protecting the lives of her own children”.
Definitely not someone who you’d want watching your back. I’m just not sure how someone who felt that way could justify collecting a military pay-check…
And I will not leave my country; just as YOU have the right to spout your neocon Warhawk drivel I have the right to voice my LEGITIMATE concerns over the state of the Union. Totalitarianism and imperialism fell after WW2 since the world did not need it anymore. We don’t OWE anyone ANYTHING. The military does not deserve respect for conquering other nations and siphoning oil and gold at the expense of American citizens.
Actually I’m not a NEOCON warhawk, I opposed both Iraqi wars, and I did check my calendar yes its not the 19th century—-more’s the pity. And thank you for making my point—Capitalism IS why we have the standard of living we have—and that means trade—and that means importing raw materials and exporting finished goods—I assume you are familiar with mercantilism—and WHY the US fleet arrived in Japan in the mid 19th century—oh yes to open markets for trade. You see overseas trade requires a large merchant fleet which in turn requires ports and a large Navy to guard both. Not too sound like Marx but he would have argued that Capitalism is the fuel of imperialism. May I suggest you take a look at Alfred Mahan’s book the Influence of Sea Power upon History. THAT was the guiding though behind US policy in the 19th century.
I don’t buy Marx’s argument but you see imperialism and capitalism do have a symbiotic relationship. My point merely was that I thought you were in error asserting our “isolationist” history. Back to my original point. Accepting your misgivings about service to an empire–and your dislike of the Military industrial complex (which I share by the way—I’m not sure why you assumed I support it) the military may not be the best choice; I don’t know that you would be happy; especially if we end up in war with Iran, which is about a 50/50 likelihood.
By the way; what exactly is wrong with an empire…besides the fact they do fall eventually? But then every country falls eventually so I don’t know why that would be the criteria. But I’m interested in your reasoning.
Thank you for your civility through the discussion. Glad we can settle our differences amicably, friend.
If you were opposed to both wars, how can you justify us being an empire? My assertion of you being a neocon was when you said:
You and everyone else in this country OWE our standard of living to the fact we’re an empire; anytime you want to give up the nice cushy place we live because empire offends you—move to some second rate hole–I hear Bulgaria is nice—wait! They had an empire turn of the century before last.
Mercantilism was certainly needed with a strong Navy, but we were an isolationist country in the early 20th century under Warren G. Harding. Imperialism is a result of capitalism, but we don’t need it in order to produce goods and services needed for the rest of the world.
An empire is inherently doomed to collapse. The bigger you are, the harder you fall. It is said that the collapse of the United States parallels that of the Roman Empire, and the lack of borders also rivals the introduction of the Xiongnu into Han China. Most empires in human history were inherently evil in their own might. When the people of a nation give up their freedoms for safety, they get neither; rather being stripped of their liberties and their children forced to grow up slaves to the government. Totalitarianism is commonly associated with the rapid expansion of an empire; a country is only as strong as its’ army.
The United States needs to have a military and a government that protects and serves the people, not exploits them.
"Our virtues and our failings are inseparable, like force and matter. When they separate, man is no more." -Nikola Tesla
By the way–I say a lot of things on these threads but one thing I don’t do is spout drivel so try and keep this adult and civil—after all you were the one asking for advice. If you don’t like or want my advice don’t take it.
And I repeat I don’t think you’re cut out for the military. Labeling/insults are the tactics of the irrational left. I suggest you will be ill served by that mechanism in the future.
I’m not associated with the left; I personally don’t buy into identity politics.
I was merely pointing out an observation based off what you said. Thank you for the advice, and I apologize for the insult.
"Our virtues and our failings are inseparable, like force and matter. When they separate, man is no more." -Nikola Tesla
Definitely not someone who you’d want watching your back. I’m just not sure how someone who felt that way could justify collecting a military pay-check…
That my friend is because many of the younger folks are not patriotic and have no love of country or its institutions. they see the military as just another “job” and focus upon what they will get out of it—there is no thought of “serving” one’s country. For that reason Mysterious Man may get his fondest wish—the collapse of our evil empire—I hope the empire that conquers and replaces ours will be as understanding and progressive on the issues of human rights as we have been….but don’t hold your breath.
I’m just kidding there MM.
I served many years in the Air Force. This thread reminds me of one female that I worked with who once said that she “didn’t think she could ever fire a gun at anybody even if it meant saving or protecting the lives of her own children”.
Definitely not someone who you’d want watching your back. I’m just not sure how someone who felt that way could justify collecting a military pay-check…
Just because I don’t believe in senseless killing does not mean I would attempt to raise a gun at anyone who tries to hurt my family or friends, or for that matter a stranger. I also don’t believe it trying to justify my actions to a ‘superior.’
If you don’t mind elaborating, what was the Air Force like for you?
"Our virtues and our failings are inseparable, like force and matter. When they separate, man is no more." -Nikola Tesla
I’m just kidding there MM.
Of course, friend. I love my country, its’ Constitution and what it stands for; I would gladly stand up against tyranny if it meant my children could enjoy a free life. However, I disapprove our current government structure, and it looks like the Trump Administration is setting up to be another Bush Administration. Understand that there is a difference between narcissism and self-prioritization. I’d be glad to serve in the military, just as long as I don’t become what we seek to ‘destroy.’
"Our virtues and our failings are inseparable, like force and matter. When they separate, man is no more." -Nikola Tesla
I believe that the U.S. military industrial complex globalist puppeteering scam only serves to spread (((democracy))) across the world and not steal gold and oil for (((them))).
Yeah. Most countries work this way. We’re not particularly good, but there have been worse countries. We were, at one point, better. Sort of. Except for all the Native American countries that got in our way. And the Spanish ones. Of course, they also murdered lots of people who got in their way.
or obey an order that does against my order.
If you cannot follow orders, blindly (there are rare, rare, rare, rare exceptions, mainly revolving around ‘will this kill me in the next five to ten minutes’), you should not join.
Up until and even after World War I, the United States was an isolationist country
Hahahahahahahahahahahaha. See Pistol Pete. We’ve never been isolationist. Not ever. We’ve been grabby. We’ve just been less prone to engage in wars that didn’t benefit us in the past.
The f~~~ing empire does not benefit our country in any way.
Well, no, because we’re running it very badly right now. A well-run empire would be a fiscal delight. Compare Victorian Britain to contemporary Britain, for example. I would posit that the petrodollar was certainly a boon for us, until we got greedy and stupid and too corrupt to realize that cutting our middle class off at the knees was a bad thing, and sold ourselves to any foreign potentate with a few pfennigs for congressional bribes. Empires can be of great delight and joy for countries that are at the center of them. I would note that Han China is doing pretty well right now, at the center of an empire of quite a few folks (such as the Uighur, or the Tibetans, or any number of other groups who do not benefit from this so much).
I think you’re thinking of military service the wrong way. If you’re really interested in joining a military that defends a reasonably awesome group on a daily basis, may I recommend joining the Israeli Defense Force? They’re probably one of the few groups around today that fit your philosophical needs. On the other hand, the pay sucks, and unless you become a lifer, there’s not really any long-term benefit to it.
Napoleon’s France probably also fit your philosophical needs, up until the point they seized the throne of Spain. Or perhaps even before then.
If you’re actually interested in a combat role (“Combat Arms”), may I recommend thinking of yourself as a mercenary? That would probably be the best way to get through it, and have some fun at the same time. On the other hand, that might not work for you. Medic might be a role that serves you well, as well as one of the overwhelming majority of positions that don’t really have a lot to do with combat. Or fighting. At all.
Air National Guard or Coast Guard would probably be a good fit, honestly.
"You can either love women, or understand women. You can't do both. Because once you understand women, you realize that there is really nothing to love."
. I’d be glad to serve in the military, just as long as I don’t become what we seek to ‘destroy.’
I’ll buy that. That is a sensible approach. This means you have principals and I can respect that, even if I happen not to agree all of them all the time. A man without principals really isn’t man at all. Many Many times I have taken a stand which was unpopular and open to ridicule because I chose to stand on principal—and although I’m not a libertarian I am a Constitutional Conservative, and a Nationalist so the Constitution is paramount in all things. (yes I’m concerned about the unbridled power of the Executive even when its doing things I like)
Just a suggestion: The next time someone hits you up with a pro-imperialism stance, try this counter argument: Can you point to a single instance where imperial exploitation yielded more profitable and equitable results for everyone than a system of voluntary mutual cooperation?
the answer of course is no, and that will stump them. So why my chicanery? Simple. One can find out much more about what someone really believes when they are mad than otherwise. Thus I withdraw my previous objection—Do it–join up—When military men have no principals and mindlessly follow orders—you get places like Dachau, and Bergen-Belson. So join up and keep these guys on the straight and narrow.
If you don’t mind elaborating, what was the Air Force like for you?
For me, the biggest reward was learning about so many different things. I enjoyed learning about the inner workings of many different types of aircraft, aircraft engines and weapon systems. I just found it all very fascinating. There was always something new that the Air Force was willing to teach me. I even received second language training which I still practice today although I’m no longer proficient. I enjoyed the travel too! I got to see parts of Germany, Britain, Norway and even Greenland.
However, I’m afraid that I must agree with PP on his initial stance that it doesn’t sound like the military is quite right for you. If your personal ideals conflict with military indoctrination then you will be miserable and you will make life miserable for those you’re serving with.
There are also a lot of bulls~~~ rules and regulations that you need to follow too. If you’re a non-conformist, you become a problem. And the military will more likely ditch you rather than deal with you…
One of the coincidences to not fall for when joining the military is that drop dead gorgeous women will hunt you down.
This is a very common occurrence.Please Remember: “They are not after me, they are after my newly acquired resources package, future, and future resources.”
This cannot be overemphasized.
In the next 2 years you will watch many men destroyed this way, do not be one of them.
Congratulations on your decision!
"It seems like there's times a body gets struck down so low, there ain't a power on earth that can ever bring him up again. Seems like something inside dies so he don't even want to get up again. But he does."
One of the coincidences to not fall for when joining the military is that drop dead gorgeous women will hunt you down.
This is a very common occurrence.Please Remember: “They are not after me, they are after my newly acquired resources package, future, and future resources.”
This cannot be overemphasized.
In the next 2 years you will watch many men destroyed this way, do not be one of them.
Congratulations on your decision!
Yeah, this is a really big one! But if you must form a relationship, at the very least stay away from military women. There’s no loyalty at all. Everyone in the military f~~~s around with everyone else.
Off the top of my head I can think of six military guys who committed suicide and each one was just over a woman…
I agree…military bitches–pump and dump EXCEPT/Unless they are much higher in rank. Even though I was a civilian employee with DoD I had to go to some of the Officer calls for the Navy due to my job and grade level and the last one I went to—well it was to install a new regional commander. A woman, two star. And at the reception—would you believe it? She was giving me the eye. I actually caught myself thinking about it…for just a second. But my red pill took control. Yes she looked like a stingy old salt.
Both my mom and dad agree that the military would be good for me since it would give me the ‘discipline’ I need
If you’re interested in cultivating discipline without joining the armed services, i would recommend a martial art – or perhaps several of them.
The only reason for me to go to the military would be to advance my career as an entrepreneur and potentially acquire some skills that would benefit me in civilian life. However, I could just enroll in a tech school and acquire the same education without the bureaucracy.
A good friend of mine is an officer in the army. He is intelligent, critical, thoughtful.
His #1 complaint is having to deal with insanely stupid people 24×7.His #2 complaint is that the army tries to do everything in the least efficient way possible.
I assume he’s venting a bit when he says these things, but i believe that they’re largely true.
For such a big decision, i’d strongly suggest working the numbers: how much the army will pay you for school/training & how many years commitment, versus how much it’d cost you on your own. Cost-benefit.
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