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Suggestius 1 year, 12 months ago.
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So the Thloh-Mung might be a mythical wild man. That’s a common mythical trope across many cultures, but it doesn’t mean it actually exists or that it’s a giant bipedal primate.
And the Yeti is, and always has been, a bear.
White tourists clearly erroneously conflated the two.The Sherpa people name the same creature by both the Yeti and the Thloh-Mung. That’s all we know. You can’t just say your opponents are wrong because the info they had written down doesn’t match with your point of view.
Those British journalists could have swatted all the rumors about the Yeti at once. They actually tried. But it looks like their findings are more fittable for the yellow press because they haven’t even shared their results with the scientific society in the proper way.Looking sort of like a human, but still just a bear.
Where did you see a normal bear looking like a human?
You have to understand you are dealing with shamanistic cultures here, and shamanistic cultures all around the world have a distinct tendency to anthropomorphise their local animals in their mythology. For example to native north americans coyotes and ravens were mythical tricksters who could take human form to trick people. To west africans it was mythical trickster spiders who did the same. But that doesn’t mean real coyotes or ravens or spiders are secretly some form of giant primate. And neither is a yeti.
You said it by yourself: “Shamanistic cultures all around the world have a distinct tendency to anthropomorphise their local animals in their mythology.” But missed a sharp detail. They didn’t treat their local “yetis” as animals. The Mansi people were and still are shamanists. They put the Menkv on the same level as the Human. Russians were enduing the Leshy with the ability to turn into humans, animals, and trees, but still, originally he looked like a human-like being. I can keep it going with the local variants.
Guess where some Gigantopithecus teeth have been found. If we can find the teeth of an extinct giant primate in a cave, why can’t we find any from a supposedly living one?
The very first teeth of the Gigantopithecus were accidentally bought on the Chinese market. And then it took two dozen years more to find some extra remains. No one would get a sponsored expedition claimed for searching the remains of a 4 meters tall primate having no significant evidence at the same time. We are absolutely in the same situation.
You’re using the wrong meaning of satyr there, and also getting the definition you are using incorrect. Satyrs are not specifically known for having hooves etc. Their actual distinguishing characteristic has always only been a permanently erect penis. Beyond that they could have any assortment of other hybrid animal parts, though only to make sure of a distinction between satyrs and men. A satyr could have cow horns or a donkey’s ears or a pig’s tail, or nothing at all just so long as it was clear it wasn’t human.
You didn’t make anything clear. Do Orangutans have something from your list: permanently erected penis, horns of a cow or pig’s tail? We both know they don’t. Why is “Satyrus” then?
Such names as Satyrus and Troglodyte (which relates directly to human-like beings) were given exactly for great apes. In other words, for our closest relatives. Having no meaning for some, it’s an interesting detail for others.But to anyone who pays attention to the actual descriptions, they clearly are not the same things.
No shoehorning at all. Let’s make a fair and clear comparison. N. American Sasquatch and the Russian Leshy.
They are human-like and walk on the feet. They live in the forest. They give a loud scream. They are very tall. They are enormously strong. Their bodies are hairy and they have long hairs on the head. They possess paranormal abilities. Often they are hostile toward the people and act territorial. They steal women for cohabitation.They really don’t.
Now you name the differences.
Happiness for all and let no one be forgotten ("Roadside picnic", Arkady and Boris Strugatsky)
When you saw the Snowman but you don’t know the language.
Happiness for all and let no one be forgotten ("Roadside picnic", Arkady and Boris Strugatsky)
The Sherpa people name the same creature by both the Yeti and the Thloh-Mung.
Do they? Or is that just an assumption made by cryptozoologists who are desperate for anything to bolster their beliefs?
Why would they have two different names for the same thing?
Where did you see a normal bear looking like a human?
I haven’t. I am able to correctly identify bears. But such cannot be said for all people, especially when the bear is standing on two feet, especially when the observer is intoxicated (and people in shamanist cultures often are), and especially those hoping to see giant primates (like those Finding Bigfoot people kept doing on television).
They didn’t treat their local “yetis” as animals.
I suggest you learn what anthropomorphise means because you are doing it wrong.
The very first teeth of the Gigantopithecus were accidentally bought on the Chinese market.
I didn’t say the first tooth was found in a cave. But that’s exactly where more teeth were found. Funny how no bigfoot teeth have been found.
No one would get a sponsored expedition claimed for searching the remains of a 4 meters tall primate having no significant evidence at the same time.
Oh please. There have been HUNDREDS of expeditions looking for bigfoots, yetis, yowies, and what have you. Not to mention all the television shows and documentaries. You can even pay to go on bigfoot hunts.
And yet there’s no proof of bigfoots or yetis etc.
Meanwhile the Bili Ape was found on the first expedition out (once the civil war ended and it was safe to go look). And yet there are far far fewer Bili Apes out there than supposed bigfoots.
Do Orangutans have something from your list: permanently erected penis,
It’s not a matter of what they actually have, but rather what Linnaeus thought they had. Check out Linnaeus’ notes on the matter. It’s quite amusing.
Such names as Satyrus and Troglodyte (which relates directly to human-like beings) were given exactly for great apes. In other words, for our closest relatives. Having no meaning for some, it’s an interesting detail for others.
That apes were given names calling them human-like beasts is of little significance, because in a way that’s what apes actually are. But it has no relevance to the existence of bigfoot etc.
They possess paranormal abilities.
*facepalm*
Do they?
None of the traits you describe are in any way diagnostic. They’re too generalized. You need to look at specific traits. For example the Leshy is supposed to have horns or antlers on his head. He is also supposed to have a retinue of wolves.
Funny how nobody ever mentions bigfoots having antlers or a wolf posse. And yet cryptozoologists claim they are the same thing as the Leshy.
Next they’re going to be saying Totoro is a bigfoot.
Do they? Or is that just an assumption made by cryptozoologists who are desperate for anything to bolster their beliefs?
Why would they have two different names for the same thing?It’s just written down as is by Charles Stonor in 1954. At the same time, he reported:”I cannot make out what it be. All descriptions point to an ape.” As you see it was happening long before.
We name two absolutely different creatures by the one name. Why they can’t have two names for the one creature?I didn’t say the first tooth was found in a cave. But that’s exactly where more teeth were found. Funny how no bigfoot teeth have been found.
the first Gigantopithecus teeth were not found also. So wait for the similar case. Then the things will go easier.
Do they?
Yes, they do.
Funny how nobody ever mentions bigfoots having antlers or a wolf posse.
How do you know? Any Native American tales about an antlered Sasquatch are welcomed.
You need to look at specific traits.
Specific traits relate to subspecies. Right now we can’t even reach an agreement if such creatures even exist as a species. Once you say they DO exist, we’ll go deeper into the subspecies. Just want to draw your attention that you didn’t name any differences yet.
Happiness for all and let no one be forgotten ("Roadside picnic", Arkady and Boris Strugatsky)
Just a motivational photo passing by. The residence of the Chugaister. Yablonitsky Pass, Carpathian Mountains, Western Ukraine.
.jpg/800px-View_from_Yablonitsky_Pass_over_the_Eastern_Carpathians_(5292-94).jpg)
Happiness for all and let no one be forgotten ("Roadside picnic", Arkady and Boris Strugatsky)
It’s just written down as is by Charles Stonor in 1954.
You mean Charles Stoner, the white person who got it wrong?
the first Gigantopithecus teeth were not found also.
The first gigantopithecus teeth were found in a chinese snake oil “medicine” shop. But later specimens were, in fact, found in caves. And specimens of other species are also found in caves such as lions, short faced bears, and all sorts of marsupials. Fossils of all sorts of species are found in caves all the time. But never bigfoots. So the “bigfoots hide their dead in caves” argument is completely invalid.
Yes, they do.
Wait. What?
You’re seriously claiming that actual bigfoots exist and they have actual paranormal powers?
Any Native American tales about an antlered Sasquatch are welcomed.
There aren’t any.
It’s one of the reasons why bigfoots are slightly, barely, remotely plausible as a living organism, because there have been large primates in the past, whereas the impossibly antlered Leshy is clearly a mythological creature and also not at all the same thing as bigfoots, because there is no such thing as a primate with antlers, not even among the prosimians.
Specific traits relate to subspecies.
It has nothing to do with species or subspecies. The common traits you gave trying to equate bigfoots to the Leshy are so generalized they can apply to just about anything. Let’s go down the list:
They are human-like and walk on the feet.
Bears can walk on two feet.
They live in the forest.
Bears live in the forest.
They give a loud scream.
Bears can roar very loudly. And eagles, coyotes, owls, and all sorts of other things can scream, including rabbits. If you hear a scream in the forest, how do you know it’s not a rabbit? Why is your first assumption it’s a bigfoot?
They are very tall.
Bears are very tall when standing on two feet.
They are enormously strong.
Bears are enormously strong.
Their bodies are hairy and they have long hairs on the head.
Bears are hairy and have hair on their heads.
They possess paranormal abilities.
*facepalm* again.
Often they are hostile toward the people and act territorial.
Bears are territorial and Timothy Treadwell found out the hard way how hostile they can be.
They steal women for cohabitation.
Are you sure they’re not just stealing them to eat them? Because bears do that. They ate Treadwell’s woman.
More likely the women ran off to f~~~ Chad and then made up some bulls~~~ story about being raped by bigfoots to avoid responsibility.
The point is, apart from the ridiculous claims about paranormal powers and raping women, none of the characteristics you gave are sufficiently diagnostic to distinguish your imaginary monsters from basic bears, so they can’t be used to claim your imaginary monsters are in any way identical.
Meanwhile specific characters describing them are sufficiently inconsistent to show that they are, in fact, not describing the same mythological entities.
You mean Charles Stoner, the white person who got it wrong?
I smell pure racism. Many times you put the intellectual abilities of the white people in question. How do you know he got it wrong? From those yellow journalists? Charles Stoner was a zoologist.
The first gigantopithecus teeth were found in a chinese snake oil “medicine” shop. But later specimens were, in fact, found in caves. And specimens of other species are also found in caves such as lions, short faced bears, and all sorts of marsupials. Fossils of all sorts of species are found in caves all the time. But never bigfoots. So the “bigfoots hide their dead in caves” argument is completely invalid.
Name those caves. Because they could be found in small caves. As an example, the Denisova Cave where the remains of Denisova hominin were found. It’s just 270 sq.m. But I’m telling you about Karst caves – a complicated system of tunnels and chambers. The Mammoth Cave in the USA is also fit. It’s length more than 600 km. There is plenty room to get lost.
t has nothing to do with species or subspecies. The common traits you gave trying to equate bigfoots to the Leshy are so generalized they can apply to just about anything. Let’s go down the list:
Bears can walk on two feet.
Disagree. In the circus or at the zoo a bear can walk for a few seconds. Show me any video of a bear walks on two feet in the forest.
Bears live in the forest.
You know stuff!
Bears are very tall when standing on two feet.
Okay.
Bears are enormously strong.
Disagree. A bear is a strong animal for sure, but not enormously strong. Villagers killed it with a fork in the pair or even one on one. At the same time, they were afraid of the Leshy strength because as they told the Leshys could pull out trees to fight each other. Like bears, right? lol
Bears are hairy and have hair on their heads.
Fail. You missed a word “long”, long hair on the head. So the hairs should be longer than those on other parts of the body. There are no such bears.
And finally, you’ve consciously missed the main trait of the creature – “human likeness”. Because this is exactly what distinguishes “my imaginary monsters” from basic bears.Happiness for all and let no one be forgotten ("Roadside picnic", Arkady and Boris Strugatsky)
Many times you put the intellectual abilities of the white people in question.
I do when they get it wrong.
Charles Stoner was a zoologist.
But not an ethnologist. Zoologists are not trained or qualified to study native mythologies, which the mistake he was making.
Name those caves.
Louchang Cave.
The Mammoth Cave in the USA is also fit. It’s length more than 600 km. There is plenty room to get lost.
It’s 640km, actually, and they only know the Mammoth Cave system is that extensive because they’ve explored all 640km. And in all those 640km they have not found a single bigfoot fossil. Not one. They’ve found plenty of bats and bears and other animal remains, including a few humans, because those things actually exist, but not one bigfoot.
But that’s beside the point. What, exactly, is a hypothetical giant primate going to eat 640km into a cave? That’s a long trek to the outside to find food, much of it up sheer vertical surfaces and past deep sumps full of water.
Bigfoots do not live kilometers down inside caves.
Show me any video of a bear walks on two feet in the forest.
I give you Pedals the Bear:
But it’s not a matter of the bear walking exclusively on its hind legs, just that it does so while humans are watching it. Which bears often do so they can get a better look at what the humans are doing.
A bear is a strong animal for sure, but not enormously strong.
I’m not exactly weak. But I’ve seen bears rip the s~~~ out of tree stumps. As far as I’m concerned, that’s enormously strong.
they were afraid of the Leshy strength because as they told the Leshys could pull out trees to fight each other.
And giants roll bowling b~~~~ in the clouds to make thunder. You get stuff like that with mythological stories.
You missed a word “long”, long hair on the head. So the hairs should be longer than those on other parts of the body.
You’ve never seen a bear after a swim or a hard run, have you? And that depends on your definition of “long”.
You also seems to have a fuzzy definition of “likeness”.
And again, what about the antlers? Or the wolf posse?
I do when they get it wrong.
All the people from different countries with scientific degrees were getting the descriptions wrong. Prove they got it wrong.
But not an ethnologist. Zoologists are not trained or qualified to study native mythologies, which the mistake he was making.
No problems. Boris Porshnev the head of the Soviet expedition for the Yeti in 1958. “A doctor of social sciences working on psychology, prehistory, and neurolinguistics as relating to the origins of man” as it’s written on his English page on Wiki. He worked on the rising of beliefs and religions. This man knew stuff.
Louchang Cave.
There is no such a cave. Give me the link.
It’s 640km, actually, and they only know the Mammoth Cave system is that extensive because they’ve explored all 640km.
Really? It is certain that many more miles of cave passages await discovery in the region.
What, exactly, is a hypothetical giant primate going to eat 640km into a cave?
Haven’t you answered your own question? They’ve found plenty of bats and bears and other animal remains,
And in all those 640km they have not found a single bigfoot fossil. Not one.
Have been not found doesn’t mean not exist.
I give you Pedals the Bear:
No, give me what I asked for. A video of a bear walks on two feet in the forest. Prove your point.
And giants roll bowling b~~~~ in the clouds to make thunder. You get stuff like that with mythological stories.
I’m speaking of the villagers from 18-19th centuries.
You’ve never seen a bear after a swim or a hard run, have you? And that depends on your definition of “long”.
I didn’t see. But villagers who lived next to the forest since the birth are able to distinguish a bear from someone who is hairy and human-like.
And again, what about the antlers? Or the wolf posse?
I told you to show me any native tales about Sasquatch with antlers, moreover which has a wolf satellite.
Happiness for all and let no one be forgotten ("Roadside picnic", Arkady and Boris Strugatsky)
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