The Sour Grapes of Ron Paul

[Faust For ScienceParticipant 22531]

The Sour Grapes of Ron Paul

I read this article today by Ron Paul: https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-02-28/ron-paul-tea-party-over

Basically, Ron Paul is claiming the “Tea Party” is over and dead.

Ron Paul could not be more wrong.

The Tea Party movement, now known as Trump Supporters, elected someone that actually is keeping his campaign promises. President Donald Trump.

You could run down the list of Tea Party platform requests and President Trump has pushed a number of them forward.

Obamacare individual mandate is gone.

One of the biggest tax cuts and tax overhauls in U.S. history.

Getting a handle on government, including budget audits and eliminating regulations.

A new Supreme Court justice.

Building the border wall and getting a handle on illegal immigration.

Looking into voter fraud.

Bringing back industry and jobs. Have the banks give been conditions for loan to small businesses.

Getting the U.S. out of TPP.

Re-negotiating NAFTA with a chance of pulling out of NAFTA.

The list goes on and on and on. And this is only a year into the Trump Administration.

Then, there is how President Trump has hammered the establishment.

The election took out two political dynasties. The Clintons and the Bushes, whom held influence in the White House for 36 years. Since Bush Senior was Vice President under President Reagan.

Also, many establishment politicians in Congress and the Senate are not running again.

Last week at CPAC, which is a major republic political convention, was pro-President Trump. There are not mean establishment people, but a lot of new faces. The Republican party is deepening its “bench” for future elections.

This article linked at the top is so incorrect it shows more than likely that Ron Paul just outed as other secret agent of globalism.

That Ron Paul was likely only “control opposition”. That for three decades Ron Paul probably pretended to be the “lone voice of dissent”. But, Ron Paul never really did anything. He never actually tried to get bills passed. All he did was complain and string along the libertarian party and those republicans wanting smaller government.

Pretenders hate when the real McCoy shows up because the real McCoy shows how hollow the pretenders are.

Ron Paul deciding to retire a few years before the Trump train, with him missing the political boat, must annoy Ron Paul. To know he missed out on being a part of all this political change, political change he claimed to support in the past, must vex him.

That folks is the sour grapes of Ron Paul.

In response, Ron Paul lashes out by claiming the Tea Party movement is dead.

No Ron Paul. The Tea Party is alive, well, and growing.

[Anonymous 42]

F~~~ that! I got my own party! ME! Who could ask for anything more? I’m just along for the ride!

Doesn’t really matter who’s driving when it’s a stolen car!

[PistolPeteParticipant 27143]

I agree Faust; the Tea Party was never a political party per se—it was more of a spontaneous political movement. And it is alive an well. Paul is just mad that it left him behind–he is a has been. BUT I still respect the guy because he at least has “some” integrity.

[743 roadmasterParticipant]

Correct, Trump is hitting all of the Tea Party issues. I would like to see a little more activism on the part of the Tea Party, with mid terms coming up. Just have to wait and see.

mgtow is its own worst enemy- https://www.campusreform.org/

[JuehueParticipant 1316]

I thought pro-Trump party is called Trump Train.

Imo introducing a third party is just harder to get elected, why call yourself a new party when you can just do entreism and replace Republican?

[IRuleMeParticipant]

Ron Paul was always a pretender and Rand is no different.

[IGMOW (I Go My Own Way)Participant 2572]

Ron Paul pushes Libertarianism in the GOP. Tea Party, connected with Ron Paul, isn’t the other Koch Party, and wasn’t even Trump supporters. What you have with the Trump (alt-right camp) is revised version Pat Buchanan’s Paleoconservatism, America first, and stay the hell out of the world. There are alliances here, but it is differences. A bunch of Libertarianism isn’t compatible with Trumpian wing of the GOP.

"I am my own thang. Any questions?" - Davis S Pumpkins.

[Faust For ScienceParticipant 22531]

IGMOW (I Go My Own Way) wrote:

A bunch of Libertarianism isn’t compatible with Trumpian wing of the GOP.

How so?

I genuinely wish to know how you believe this to be the case? What your logic is behind your statement?

I found the Tea Party to not be libertarian in the first place, but having their roots in the 1990’s “Contract With America” branch of the Republican Party. With the Tea Party members switching to supporting President Trump, as his supports after President Trump doing the election made it clear, in not so many words, he agreed with many of the items of the Tea Party platform, which I listed in the above article.

[IGMOW (I Go My Own Way)Participant 2572]

Faust For Science wrote:

IGMOW (I Go My Own Way) wrote:

A bunch of Libertarianism isn’t compatible with Trumpian wing of the GOP.

How so?

I genuinely wish to know how you believe this to be the case? What your logic is behind your statement?

I found the Tea Party to not be libertarian in the first place, but having their roots in the 1990’s “Contract With America” branch of the Republican Party. With the Tea Party members switching to supporting President Trump, as his supports after President Trump doing the election made it clear, in not so many words, he agreed with many of the items of the Tea Party platform, which I listed in the above article.

The Tea Party platform was never really about Libertarian to begin with. It was mainly in opposition to liberals trying to raise taxes. The original protest was around something also Occupy had, which was Wall Street being bailed out by Washington. Occupy went more anti-corporate in their protests, with a bucket of socialists and communists hanging around the camps, along with a bunch of dregs that fell between the gaps. Tea Party saw Washington as the problem. It was a protest against Washington, and government policies. On this protest against Washington, you can have Libertarians agree in it.

The agreement holds so long as you aren’t in power, and have a common enemy. Moment you do get power, then the differences manifest and lead to division, right down to Ron Paul not agreeing with the Tea Party.

And with this, you see the divide, and chunks of differences. Libertarians value freedom above all, with minimal government. What you have in Paleoconservatism reframed as ethnically pure nationalism in Trumpian camp, is America dominant above every other nation, and all other nations meeting America’s interests and strength, above all others. It isn’t about freedom, but dominance. It is a matter of doing this at all costs, by any means. It is triumph, not freedom. And here, I will editorialize saying this approach leads to authoritarian structures. The desire to win at all costs will end up pushing for a champion, and strong leader, and a call for this. This leadership structure is also what will differ from Libertarianism. Libertarians who oppose Trump oppose Trump when he goes bigger government and acts authoritarian, which he does.

So, push comes to shove, when you have Trump vs Rand Paul, as a choice, the Tea Party will get behind Trump and not Rand Paul. You also see the split here, when you polled Tea Party folks about Ron Paul when he ran, and only a minority supported him. Ron Paul is too much classic liberal for the Tea Party.

What you see with Trump, is what he proposed today, which was to slap tariffs on foreign steel and aluminum. That is NOT Libertarian. The Drug war by session isn’t either. And it goes on and on and on.

Alliances can be formed over some issues, but there ends up being a number of issues that there can’t be agreement with.

"I am my own thang. Any questions?" - Davis S Pumpkins.

[Faust For ScienceParticipant 22531]

IGMOW, that was a very well written statement. I do not agree with everything you posted, but I can see how you came to your conclusion. Thank you.

[IGMOW (I Go My Own Way)Participant 2572]

Faust For Science wrote:

IGMOW, that was a very well written statement. I do not agree with everything you posted, but I can see how you came to your conclusion. Thank you.

Welcome. There are fractures with the GOP that are masked by opposing something. If the GOP and Libtertarian party were completely compatible, the Libertarian party would go away. But, the reality is people don’t really want less government at all. What they want is more government that benefits them personally, and less that doesn’t. Corporations need government to survive, and lower class needs handouts. The Middle Class needs to provide security, and the upper class wants government to make their problems go away.

No, I can understand any Trump supporter disagreeing with my view that Trump is authoritarian, as they likely don’t think so (they would call it “strong leadership”). Because of this I hope it was understood that entire section is “my opinion”. I say it, not as a wishful thinking, or preference, but how I see it. I understand others wouldn’t agree.

Anyhow, there may be others, but there are reasons why Ron Paul is saying what he is saying.

"I am my own thang. Any questions?" - Davis S Pumpkins.

[Faust For ScienceParticipant 22531]

IGMOW (I Go My Own Way) wrote:

There are fractures with the GOP that are masked by opposing something. If the GOP and Libtertarian party were completely compatible, the Libertarian party would go away.

The problem with the Libertarian party is they deal in absolutes in everything way. Not just refusing to budge on their beliefs, but their tactics. The Libertarian party believes in either winning the presidency, or not bothering at all.

This sometimes makes me wonder if the Libertarian party is only a strawman party to prevent genuine third party nationalist parties to rise, because the Libertarian party does have the resources to win some federal level congressional and senate seats. That is possible. But, those that run the Libertarian party refuse to do so.

[IGMOW (I Go My Own Way)Participant 2572]

Faust For Science wrote:

IGMOW (I Go My Own Way) wrote:

There are fractures with the GOP that are masked by opposing something. If the GOP and Libtertarian party were completely compatible, the Libertarian party would go away.

The problem with the Libertarian party is they deal in absolutes in everything way. Not just refusing to budge on their beliefs, but their tactics. The Libertarian party believes in either winning the presidency, or not bothering at all.

This sometimes makes me wonder if the Libertarian party is only a strawman party to prevent genuine third party nationalist parties to rise, because the Libertarian party does have the resources to win some federal level congressional and senate seats. That is possible. But, those that run the Libertarian party refuse to do so.

Libertarians would work far better if they stopped trying to run for office, and tried to build their own Galt’s Gulch. They aren’t interested in anything practical, just get their message out there. How many of them actually run for mayor, etc? They just don’t. I had attended a number of Libertarian meetings in the past, and it had some impact on my thinking, as did my obtaining anarchist literature. Over they years, I had moved further and further away from statism.

The thing about Libertarianism is that it is far more of a worldview, than a political party. It isn’t about nationalism, but freedom. And everything is organized around this ideal. It can ignore facts or practical issues. It ideally wants less government, and as little as possible. If such were applied to being a CEO, you would run as a CEO to do as little as possible in a company. People don’t elect people to do less. They elect people to solve problems, and do things they aren’t able to do themselves.

The way the current political system is set up, you really can’t do any third party. Nations with Parliments (sp) have different parties and you can do things. They form alliances over different issues and deal make. In America, you are forced into two camps, and that is it. Compromise comes by joining one of two political parties and unifying behind a platform.

I personally can’t trust my future to any group of people coming together at all.

"I am my own thang. Any questions?" - Davis S Pumpkins.

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