Home › Forums › MGTOW Central › My Response to an open letter to the men of MGTOW!
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Anonymous 3 years, 7 months ago.
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I read an article today written by a very interesting non MGTOW. In his article he has given our movement a lot of constructive criticism and I hate to admit it but a lot of what he said is right. In particular he was most correct about the “B Group”. These MGTOWs in B Group whine way too much about Shaming. I know that because some of them even complained about me Shaming them for being celibate. Now what he said about “A Group” which is what I’m part of is not entirely true. He said that we as MGTOWs are ashamed of giving up legal marriage when in all actuality there is nothing to be ashamed of. When a man is going to look for a woman to marry, it is very much like gambling in a Casino. In Casino the game is always rigged to the point that most of the time the casino owner wins and takes everyone’s money. In the marriage maket the woman is like the casino owner because she takes 50%-75% of the man’s income in the divorce. People who get married are extremely likely to get divorced. The likely hood of finding a woman who isn’t going to walk out on her husband is very low, which is why the woman always wins just like the owner of a Casino. Now here is the link to the article that criticizes us.
http://www.returnofkings.com/87663/an-open-letter-to-the-men-of-mgtowThere are several wrong ways to take this kind of criticism, but there is only one right way. We need to make improvements, particularly when it comes to our attitudes. We need to stop acting like losers and act like the winners that we know we are! Those she-devils who call themselves feminists have over influenced our society and tried to get us to play a game called marriage. Women are weaker than men. The weak drag down the strong. We MGTOWs have no one dragging us down. We have already won the marriage game just by not participating in it. We have more money, energy, testosterone, and life quality than any of those married Cuckolds. What is with the negativity of B Group? You people in B Group need to be way more positive and I don’t give a damn about political correctness so don’t any of you lecture me about shaming! I think we need to take the constructive criticism of this journalist and use it to recruit more members, improve our movement, and each and everyone of its members. Self empowerment is the key to success! Let’s do it!
I'm married to the game,but she broke her vows.
What movement?
This ‘journalist’ can take his letter and his groups and shove them.
I’m not looking to ‘recruit’ anyone.
I am in the NFG ‘group’.The answer is NO. “I could but I won’t”. Memini murum!
We need to stop acting like losers and act like the winners that we know we are!
The only way to win in a rigged game is not to play.
Well, first of all, MGTOW is not a movement. Secondly I never heard of this A B group non sense. I agree that MGTOW is about self realization and improvement, but for many men, the wound is too deep and the poison is too strong, they are not whining, they are venting. This is pretty much the only place where men can talk freely about the injustice they’ve faced in society and there’s nothing wrong with it. It helps heal the wound and dilute the poison. Once the red pill rage phase is over, many MGTOWs will have the power and energy to focus on what we want to do. But it takes time, so don’t rush and don’t judge, because they’ve endured much s~~~ in life. And don’t try to come up with this idea that certain MGTOWs are better, cooler than other MGTOWs just because they are able to get over the pain faster than others. I am not saying we should support whatever people do or say in the name of MGTOWs, it’s not a cult, but show understanding and empathy, you don’t know how much pain and courage people had to overcome in order to take the first step towards freedom.
. These MGTOWs in B Group whine way too much about Shaming.
Talking about isn’t whining. I remember back in 2006 I warned this guy about marriage. I told him not to get married due to the divorce rate. Some mangina started telling me to quit whining.
Why don’t these clowns quit “whining” about MGTOW?"If pussy was a stock it would be plummeting right now because you've flooded the market with it. You're giving it away too easy." - Dave Chapelle
It seems to me like this guy is just trying to create a few boxes and then try to put everyone in them. I personally don’t see MGTOW as a box.
It’s kind of like going through the 5 stages of grief, and then picking on the people who are in the anger or denial phase for not reaching acceptance fast enough for his liking.
Order the good wine
Yeah, this A/B group s~~~ is nonsense.
Go ahead and try to categorize a bunch of dudes, who are doing their own thing, into superior and inferior groups, and then claim to be in the superior group, if it makes you happy… but just know its self aggrandizing bulls~~~.
The only “groups” I can conceive of are: people who understand what MGTOW is, and people who don’t (and these people prove it by making up f~~~ing retarded “groups”)
Im usually more patient and respectful than this, but claiming to be MGTOW doesnt necessitate calling out other MGTOW for not MG-TOWING correctly…
Sorry not sorry.
"Compare your lives to mine and then kill yourselves" -BBR
Listen, this guy might be considered smart in some circles. Fine. He knows a few tricks. Fine. Divide and conquer. Split us into two groups, first, so if attacked he can claim he was talking about the other group. Second, so he can make some of us fight each other or at least seed some discord.
But if you look at all of his direct attacks it is MGTOW as a whole that he is attacking.
Basically his(and many of the commenters’) problem is that we are not MRAs. That we don’t fit a specific category or doctrine or pattern or ideology. That’s exactly what they hate, that we are not a movement that can be pinpointed, that we don’t have common a purpose or goal that can be attacked. They just don’t f~~~ing get that we are all individually going our own way and we don’t give a damn about their f~~~ing standards.
We’ve already won boys! You go on and keep fighting your fight. I wish you luck!The answer is NO. “I could but I won’t”. Memini murum!
Im usually more patient and respectful than this, but claiming to be MGTOW doesnt necessitate calling out other MGTOW for not MG-TOWING correctly…
That sentence must have required a bit of mind-f~~~ery to write, but well said.
The answer is NO. “I could but I won’t”. Memini murum!
Secondly I never heard of this A B group non sense.
It is just the same alpha/beta bulls~~~ women profess to justify their bad choices in sexual partners. With the woman saying, “The man I slept with is an alpha-man, therefore my choice is not wrong. You are beta losers because no woman wants you.”
The truth is we just won’t tolerate the bulls~~~ women show towards us.
I would rather be alone than spend time with someone I can not trust.
While I’m not as critical of MGTOW as the others who dismiss the whole movement as a congregation of virgin losers
Instead of going their own way to live a fulfilling life, they’re using the movement as a crutch to justify and validate their lack of zest for life.
I’ll generalize the movement into two groups
but it’s the B group that is swelling in numbers and defining the movement as a whole.
The movement has gone to a point where even helping yourself is somehow seen as a sinister effort to turn you into a drone.
The Group B are taking over the movement and they’re not doing themselves or the movement any favor.
RoK, you’re hilarious. Hell, the subtitle for this article is “One outsider’s perspective”. And I don’t know if it’s just me, but the first paragraph sounds like suspiciously specific denial.
Anonymous3Let us read just a small quote:
While I’m not as critical of MGTOW as the others who dismiss the whole movement as a congregation of virgin losers, I do feel that a large segment of its members are lost. Instead of going their own way to live a fulfilling life, they’re using the movement as a crutch to justify and validate their lack of zest for life. They’re essentially selling themselves short.
He does not go so far as saying we are all virgin losers.
How far does he goes? The reader is left wondering…
This is a typical coward insult trick, like: I am not saying he is an asshole.
But I personaly will say: he is an asshole. Its not a shamming tactic, I think he really is.Everything for them is a “shame” tactic. Want to be in a happy relationship with a woman? Pussy worshiper. Offering information on self-improvement? Scam to sell products. Free tips on how to live the life you want? More shaming tactics.
Now there is no shamming tactic in him at all! Let us forget the oppening “virgin losers” and look at these proposals for a “better” way…
“Happy” relationship with a woman: anything else is being unhappy.
“Information on Self-improvement”, and “how to live the life you want” : a contradition in itself. Either you want or or are told what you should want.When you are told what you SHOULD want there is an inherent criticism of what you really want. In fact he goes so far as to say:
This is the sort of attitude you would expect from a hater who is jealous of another man’s success, which is why many men feel repellent to MGTOW as a whole.
No. I am not reading it wrong. He says that either you conform or you are a hater and repellent. No shamming tactic again, I guess.
The blunt truth is this: men absolutely hate seeing weakness in other men. This is not some conspiracy to “shame” men into doing something they’re not supposed to like, it’s a fact of human nature. We men have an innate awareness of how infectious weakness can be, and guess what? The MGTOW community reeks of it.
Again, withou any shamming tactics at all, he says MGTOW reeks of weakness and its infectious.
But why are we weak? Because we fail to take his lead.
Guess what? We go our own way… He may be happy with all the women he wants and following his own advises.a lot of constructive criticism
Sorry, but you gotta be f~~~ing kidding. I’m all for constructive criticism and if is there anything MGTOW miss the most, is having its views challenged. Whoever is willing to do that with, at minimum should be honest and do his homework. The author didn’t do any. He kept calling MGTOW a “movement”, talks about “goals”, says he is being wrongfuly acused of trying to shame the mgtow crowd “group B”, to finaly say in the end that “you should be ashamed” for not doing what he (who is completely ignorant about mgtow, as he proves in his previous paragraphs) is telling you to do.
Am I all for it. Bring criticism. Point facts. Be rational. In fact, that was the first thing I looked for when stumbled on MGTOW. I stopped doing it because all I get is the default angry-loser-videogame-player-who-can’t-get-laid.
Speaking of whic: I got more than a hundred woman in my bed(Hell, it could have been easily two hundred if I was dedicated to this day.). Many of them went straight from the dating site to my home. A few of them got naked and sucked my dick without kissing me. I was signaled to a three-some many times, but just shrugged. I prefer just one each time (Like, five in the same day?) I practice muay-thai, chinese boxing, BJJ, and lost count of how many instructors and competitors I schooled in different gyms, some of them bigger and stronger. I came from the second poorest area of my city with an absent father and today at 36 I gave the middle finger to my employees, live by passive income and is deciding what to do with the monthly excess. While in the poor area, I saw shots fired, corpses, negotiated me and my friends release with a gun pointed to our head (off-duty drunk cop thought we were drugdealers following him).
Since I’m an anonymous internet person, do they think its all bulls~~~? It only makes me even more proud of everything I did, for all that looking so hard to achieve that it can only be seen as a “virgin-gamer” fantasy to someone.
Maybe they will believe it? Am I “alpha” enough for them? Do I deserve more of their respect now? Good. Because what I have to say is: who da f~~~ those guys think they are to tell a man what he should do to make them happy?
Oh, no! But I cried for woman before, more than once! Begged for them in tears to no leave me. Contemplated suicide for that. I like manners, respect, don’t have a “though skin”. Play weird, roguelike ASCII terminal games. Oh s~~~, I’m just a pussy.
tl;dr: criticism are more than welcome to me, but at least do your homework.
lot of constructive criticism
1. How can it be constructive criticism when he doesn’t know what he is talking about?
2. How can it be constructive criticism when I don’t give a f~~~, what he has to say?
3. How can it be constructive criticism when I’m going MY own f~~~ing way and not his? It’s like when my ex-wife criticized me about how I did the f~~~ing dishes. I told her she can either do them herself or just let me do things my way. Either way, I don’t have to listen to her micromanagement.
How am I going my own way if I’m doing things somebody else’s way? It’s guys like this that want MGTOW to be a movement so they can hijack it.MGTOW. It’s a personal choice, not a movement. Therefore anything he has to say is complete and utter s~~~.
"I asked you a question. I didn't ask you to repeat what the voices in you head are telling you" ~ Me. ........Yes I'm still angry.
I loosely recognize the group A/B thing. Every collection of people has them. You’ve got the people that are strong, have other options, yet are committed. On the other end, you have the others that are there because it’s a safe place for them and they don’t seem to prosper anywhere else. Given another convenient option, they may bolt without a second thought.
All that said though…so what? The truth isn’t dependent on the messenger. The fact that some would bolt if they had better options doesn’t mean there are better options out there.
Ok. Then do it.
MGTOW: Men Going Their Own Way
My own way is based on the understanding that I will end up being enslaved to a female and her spawn, have my life, emotions and assets drained without any hint that any of these sacrifices will be reciprocated in a meaningful way by the modern female in question or even her spawn. In fact it’s more than probable that no man has ever had his sacrifices paid back in a meaningful way and I hate throwing crap shoots with my life on the line.
My MGTOW is to look after myself and do things that please me while making sure that no female is ever given the chance to f~~~ anything up.
Damn, this article is dripping with blue pill-ness. So basicaly we lack direction because we aren’t living exactly how the dude think it’s best. What part of going your way he didn’t understand? Every part it seems.
If some guy wants to spend his life playing videogames, watching porn and basicaly doing only what he wants that means to go his own way.
Pity and contempt are siblings. You only feel pity for those you consider weak.
Too noticeable over many years in the gym, is that guys with phenomenal strength or an outrageous physique go about their workouts in a quiet professional manner. The weight they are lifting or the body being tortured screams for itself. What they’ve achieved inspires others to greatness, to bear down to go through living hell to achieve the same, to follow their behavior.
This is in direct contrast to the village jackass who criticizes others’ form or weight or reps or regimen…….and yet on closer examination by all others, has totally won the quest for mediocrity in and of himself."It seems like there's times a body gets struck down so low, there ain't a power on earth that can ever bring him up again. Seems like something inside dies so he don't even want to get up again. But he does."
Anonymous3I said he is an asshole, and I am not resorting to name calling. Its a FACT!
And I can prove it using the “how to be an asshole” pointers:
1) Listening? Ain’t nobody got time for that!
Check. If he reads MGTOW he would know that we cannot see any “happy relationship” with women.
2) Dismiss, dismiss, dismiss!
Check. Like saying we are to concerned with shamming, and then using shamming.
3) Arrogance is bliss
Check. He knows how to help men be more men, and anything else is for weak men.
4) Apologising is for ssissies
Check. If you go against other people lifestyle and shame them for it, there is no need to apologise… Just shame them again for not liking it.
5) Personal responsibility? What’s that?
Check. If you are somehow connected to male issues and you advise men to enter “happy relationships” with women…
6) Minimise, deny and blame!
Check. He puts MGTOW down as weak, and infectious. He denies that he is preaching from a higher position, and blames MGTOW for not listenning!
7) You’re the expert!
Check. HE IS THE EXPERT, he know everything about masculinity and relationships.He is an asshole.
I’ve been puzzling over why these PUAs are so “concerned” about the well-being of MGTOW. They really seem hung up on us, when the fact is that they should be grateful that we are dropping out and reducing their competition. The oft-cited commercial motive is definitely one aspect (more MGTOW = fewer desperate pussy beggars to buy PUA product). I think another is the fact that many PUAs are actually closet homosexuals. They protest too much, spending all their time trying to convince others (and possibly themselves) that they think pussy is the greatest thing ever, and the ultimate source of male happiness. That’s high praise indeed for a wet hole. Suspiciously so. Compared to MGTOW, their display behavior becomes obvious for the caricature of masculinity that it is. “No, I’M not gay–look at all that trim I chase. I’m a MANLY man, really I am.” Maybe this is why we threaten them so…our very existence forces them to face uncomfortable questions they would rather suppress. I suppose they could have unresolved mother issues as well, thus the constant quest for female approval, but really I think they’re a bunch of fraidy-f~~s who aren’t man enough to come out and be what and who they are, so they keep up the big act. Part of that act seems to be pointing the finger at MGTOW in a forlorn attempt to distract from just how absurd their own posturing really is.
[W]e are MGTOW. We eat shaming language like tic tacs.
--chir
I have known more men destroyed by the desire to have wife and child and to keep them in comfort than I have seen destroyed by drink and harlots.
--William Butler Yeats
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