historical fun facts

[Mr. SmithParticipant 686]

Gentlemen,

just read this one and it is too good not to share.

In world war two US-tanks reached Berlin before Soviet tanks. How? The first Soviet unit to enter Berlin was the 1st Mechanized Corps, part of the 2nd Guards Tank Army, Zhukov’s 1st Byelorussian Front. As it turns out, the 1st Mechanized Corps was completely equipped with Shermans from lend-lease of military equipment to the Soviets. So in essence, American tanks reached Berlin before Soviet tanks! Ouch!

"I need men, real men, men with balls, certainly not sissies. I would never ask them to take an enemy position, but I insist that they follow me to that position. If you are one of those men, raise your hand." Napoleon Bonaparte

[Max PowerParticipant 2721]

Tanks for that! Very interesting, didn’t know that detail. Ironic eh?

[PistolPeteParticipant 27143]

Figures—but unfortunate. A Sherman M4A4 has no chance against a Mark VI, at least a T34/85 has a chance.

[joetechParticipant]

PistolPete wrote:

Figures—but unfortunate. A Sherman M4A4 has no chance against a Mark VI, at least a T34/85 has a chance.

The British used to call Shermans Ronsons (after the cigarette lighter) because they lit the first time they were hit.

"Don't follow in my footsteps...I stepped in something."

[GregB0Participant]

Anything mounting a 75 main gun always lost to anything mounting an 88 main gun.

A case of terminal Bad Booga.

​"​My father didn't tell me how to live; he lived, and let me watch him do it.​" - Clarence Buddinton Kelland

[Mr. SmithParticipant 686]

PistolPete wrote:

Figures—but unfortunate. A Sherman M4A4 has no chance against a Mark VI, at least a T34/85 has a chance.

The German defenders of Berlin had seven tanks left at this moment and no fuel and very limited ammunition. No matter what you send, it’s better than that.

"I need men, real men, men with balls, certainly not sissies. I would never ask them to take an enemy position, but I insist that they follow me to that position. If you are one of those men, raise your hand." Napoleon Bonaparte

[Mr. SmithParticipant 686]

GregB0 wrote:

Anything mounting a 75 main gun always lost to anything mounting an 88 main gun.

A case of terminal Bad Booga.

Yes and no. In a direct confrontation, yes. The Tiger is hopelessly overrated. It’s an example of bad engineering. There was more Tigers destroyed by their own crew than by enemy contact. I think the worst weapon you can think of is the one you need to destroy yourself. The tank was notoriously unreliable and hard to maintain. To fix a wheel you had to disassemble up to 5 other wheels. It took hours. The electric system never really worked. No sloping armor in the 1940s. It goes on…
It would been better to copy the concept of the T-34. Simple, rugged, easy to produce. Just a few improvements, better armor, the 88 for the gun and a radio for every tank, but it was completely unthinkable to admit the Soviets had the better tank concept.
The Sherman was not that bad as always told. It was easy to produce in masses, much simpler to maintain than the Tigers and very versatile. Look how the Israelis modified it later. If some of this improvements would have been done in say 1944, the public opinion on the Sherman would be completely different.
Somehow it was an unfinished tank sent to fight an enemy who not just invented modern tank warfare, but also had a lot of experience in it. With better tactics, some improvement to the Sherman and a better use of it’s main advantage to be available in large numbers it would have made a much better impact right from the beginning. Later, when some of this was adopted, the Sherman still could not take a direct hit from a 88, but it didn’t matter anymore, because of it’s numbers and speed it became a real problem for German tanks. You’ve lost no matter how good your tank is if it is surrounded by 10 or 20 tanks good enough and air superiority on the other side.

"I need men, real men, men with balls, certainly not sissies. I would never ask them to take an enemy position, but I insist that they follow me to that position. If you are one of those men, raise your hand." Napoleon Bonaparte

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